Well, I'm going to introduce my colleague, Betha Gutsche, who has been working on this project as a program manager, and I will let Betha introduce our other panelists for the day. 
Welcome, Betha. 
>> Thank you, Jennifer, and I want to welcome Beth Farley from the Bellingham public library, and Eileen Shaw from the everson branch of the Whatcom county library system. 
Both these libraries are in Washington state, and we will be hearing later from Beth and Eileen about their experiences and insights on their own space transformation projects. 
Oops, sorry. 
Just keep going. 
So, transforming library space for community engagement. 
I just want to let you know that the emphasis, the focus of this Webinar is really on physical space. 
So, how are you changing -- what are the potential and possibilities for, for changing the physical space and how does that, that start to alter perceptions from your community and engagement from your community about, about their feelings about the library. 
Now, I always like to start by engaging the audience, and we're going to do an exercise that involves using the check mark, so, this is a check mark refresher. 
You will find this on the tool bar about the presentation panel. 
Look for that square in the dropdown arrow to the right of the square. 
From that dropdown menu, select the check mark, and get ready to use it on the next screen, and just know that, that once you have checked, you cannot move your check mark, and which is ok. 
I just want you to know once you put a, a mark on the screen, it stays there. 
>>> So, I would like to take the pulse of this audience here, and get an idea of where you are in this continuum of a perception of libraries. 
Are they mostly about books and study? 
Are they mostly about community events and making things? 
Are they somewhere in the middle of that continuum? 
And yes, you are welcome to get those big, fat highlighters and make check marks for greater emphasis, and I am such a visual person, that I love color, and you all are, are distributing your check marks with a very lovely color balance. 
So, that's interesting. 
We do have -- we have a range, so we have some of the, some of the extreme left and we have a few people at the extreme right and, and but many of us fall in the middle of that spectrum of that continuum, not surprising. 
Ok, if you could withhold your checking for, for the moment, because we're going to go to the next screen and, and I'm going to ask you to, to guess which of these percentages is correct, and this is some data collected by the 2010, OCLC library perception report asking their responders if, and books the first thing that comes to mind when you think of libraries? 
How many of these responders thought that, that libraries are all about books? 
 there is a lot of checking going on, on the 87%, so in spite of our own perceptions about our libraries, we feel the public very heavily thinks it's about books, and the percentage is 75%, and what is really fascinating, though, in a previous study, in 2005, 69% said that the books were the first thing that comes to mind, so in that five-year ensuing period with more mobile devices and 
other digital information and alternatives coming, into play, the percentage, actually, increased of how the public thinks about libraries. 
And, and maybe there is a really strong reason why the public thinks about libraries. 
if you do a search on flickr, for just library, to get some images, you get a sea of images that are all books and books and more books and more books. 
So, if really isn't surprising that this perception of the library as a book repository is so pervasive because it's reinforced by the physical experience, when they walk into libraries. 
 there is the other extreme. 
There is the first bookless library in bear county in Texas called biblio-tech. 
This has gotten some very controversial responses. 
I came across one article when I was searching that this that the title of the article was, another sign of the Apocalypse, so, it's so interesting that, that, even though there are still books, they just are in the electronic format, electronic journals, and there is access to information, and it's just having the warm and fuzzy of the facts full of books, and it raised some dismay on the part of 
the public and even other librarians. 
The reality really is, is somewhere in between. 
That the libraries are really not, especially the modern libraries, are really not necessarily primarily about books, even if it's perceived that way. 
That people go to the library, and maybe thinking of that, and looking for, for, for information, but, it's a place where they find each other, and this is that whole notion of library is a place. 
Library as a public space, where people can be together and feel sort of part of the greater common experience without necessarily knowing each other and part of that whole sense of, of place-making is very powerful, powerful aspect of libraries, and I think that what we're going to -- what we would like to explore today is how we can really, really build on that reality of the experience of 
libraries, by, by doing some, some alterations to the physical space. 
So, I would like to look at a few examples. 
We'll start with this, this wonderful, wonderful creative example at the oak park public library, and it's called the idea box, and this was a space, that's in that, in the entry area, before you get into the library, and it used to be a cafe and coffee shop. 
And it's now been turned into, into this, this rotating, engaging, community participation space, where they do a whole series of, of, of creative but relatively simple activities to, to invite the public of all ages into, into this, this space, and this is just some post-it, some pens, and an invitation to write down the name of their favorite book and post-it on the wall, and the participants, 
themselves, do this creative rearrangement and, and, and very colorful display that turns it into an environment and an experience. 
Then they did -- they painted the space with black magnetic paint, and got the, the magnetic poetry in the, and the public came in, and they wrote poetry, movable poetry all over the walls. 
I love this one. 
This is the "shake it" box, and they draped it with the reflective foil and it turns into a dance box with everybody coming in and having a great time. 
And then this one, inviting people to create their own book covers. 
So again, just some paper, some pens, and a lot of creativity. 
Elicited from the public. 
And the street press, they bought an espresso book-making machine, and as a result, they became a center of community publishing, so, this invites local authors, it kind of pulls local authors out of the woodworker, together, and to share their experiences, and they offer writing classes, so it becomes a much larger shared experience, and the community is actively creating content and contributing 
to the collection, so, very exciting. 
the, the book machine is on the second floor, and it is out in the open, but it is separated from the main area of the library. 
Then we get to makerspaces. 
Several are us are not in love with the name. 
This is the free library fab lab, it is really -- the idea has really caught on in the last couple of years. 
This is in a dedicated facility. 
It's a separate room that was strictly furniture warehouse, so a very appropriate place to be making things and inviting the community in. 
I really like a definition I found on the Missoula, Montana, the Missoula public library's website about their makerspace, they say it's a place to get the training, tools, and camaraderie, very important, camaraderie to start turning their ideas into physical things. 
So that takes it way out of the realm are focusing on the printer, turning ideas into physical things, and this wonderful quote from Jim semmelroth, who works at the library, it's the learning and the satisfaction that take place when you do it yourself is the whole point. 
So this is really, an essence of this community engagement idea that the library can facilitate. 
Up to now, the examples I have shown you are all in spaces that are separate from the main part of the library. 
Until we get to the maker space, it was built at the Westport public library in Connecticut, and they did build it right in the middle of the library. 
Those are the book facts surrounding it. 
You can see into it, and you can see out of it, so, there is a, a very, very transparent experience whether you are inside that space or outside of it. 
>> I thought this was so audacious when I heard about this two years ago. 
And I wanted to check back in and see if they had regrets about the placement of the library, and I got a response from bill, who is the assistant director and innovation and user experience, and he said, initially, we put it in the middle, as a symbol of the transformation of the meaning of the library. 
He very, very emphatically stated that they are still very, very glad that it is where it is because it serves to just shout out to everyone that libraries are also about creating and not just consuming. 
This is really an idea about libraries and the perception of libraries that is in its own process of transformation, and really being reinforced by some of the great examples and experiments. 
It's this idea of carving out space in the middle of the library that we at OCLC had this wonderful opportunity to explore further through a grant from the Allen family foundation, that's Paul Allen, a Washington-based foundation, and we received a grant to take this idea of really exploring the evolution of physical space and see how that enriches services and opens up new possibilities. 
We identified two libraries, two pilot projects, and they are in different sizes of communities, so Bellingham public library has, has -- the city has a population of 82,000, and the everson branch of Whatcom county, which surrounds Bellingham, that branch is in a very small community of 3,000. 
So, we have Beth Farley from Bellingham and Eileen Shaw from everson, and I am going to talk to each of them and get some idea of the experiences that they had, sort of the process that they went through as they evolved their physical spaces, and some of the lessons learned. 
So, we're going to start with Beth at Bellingham, and they built a space there, and they named skill share, and I think that they came up with the name early, and you will hear more about this, this, I don't know, we'll call it a tag line, the read, learn, meet, discover, and how the skill share space really fit with that meaning of the, of the direction of their library. 
So, Beth, let's -- 
>> Hi. 
>> Hi. 
>> Thank you very much for being here. 
Just so everyone knows, I am going to flash through pictures of the space, as Beth is talking. 
Let's start out by, by just understanding what led to your decision on how you wanted to transform the space in the library and how did you decide where to locate it. 
>> Ok. 
Well, our decision was informed by the tremendous input that we received from the community when we were developing our current strategic plan. 
We had over 3,000 survey responses that made it loud and clear to us that the community strongly valued the, the library as a place to meet and connect. 
So, when we talk about meet, we know creating thriving spaces where the community comes together and shares their stories. 
So, the schoolshare space alliance with our vision for providing an alternative programming space. 
We wanted a space with fewer hurdles than our traditional meeting rooms. 
Excuse me, we were influenced by the maker spaces at other libraries, and in that spirit we wanted to purposely develop an experimental space here. 
This would be a new venue for community members to present the free demonstration, have an event or an activity in an informal setting. 
This could be a baby sign language class or a master gardener demonstrating how to save seeds. 
Our goal is to develop new partnerships in the community and provide a place for connection and collaboration. 
So, we envision skillshare as a place where people can just come together, maybe they are gaming, working on projects, book-sharing or creating arts. 
Simply, a place where people can learn from each other. 
>> And that's great. 
And I pulled this quote from a previous conversation that we had because you, reading the results from your survey, you really started to see that idea that the community had about the library as the convening space, and you thought, it's starting to feel like do it together, rather than do it yourself and really building on what does that look like? 
>> Yeah. 
>> So, what did you need to do to clear out the space, and what was the hardest thing that you had to let go of to make way for skillshare? 
>> Well, you know, we knew that we wanted to put skillshare in a high traffic location. 
So, where it is, is, is near the front entrance, and it's, actually, placed in between our [Inaudible] and new books, and opposite is the self checkout. 
So, what we know is that many people just pop into the library, and they pick up their holes, and they, they -- they browse the new books, and use self checkout, and off they go. 
So, this space is smack center for many users. 
They don't just venture much further into the library. 
So, we wanted to attract patrons who may not normally attend traditional programs. 
We were interested in seeing what would happen when patrons, you know, happened upon something unexpected, you know, and then those users could choose to engage or not in what's happening. 
They would get a flavor of what the library could offer, and then in turn, you know, suggest things that we could do in the future. 
It's really interesting to observe, you know, people coming upon something because, you know, some people just ignore what's happening. 
Others want to stop and watch. 
But, then there is others who really want to jump in and participate. 
So, you know, the clear, to clear out that space, that space housed the adult music c.d. collection, and we noticed the past several years that, that circulation has been trending down, you know, probably because of the availability of, of the free music online. 
But, to get that collection out of there, we had to, to, to remove a section of non fiction that was about 40 shelves of books, and to make way for, for the c.d.s. 
So, you know, it was not hard to let go of that collection space because we have staff at all levels and volunteers flagging, unattractive and damage claims materials for review. 
Our selectors wish that they had more time for it so once we downsized the c.d. collection, and weeded and shifted the non fiction, we were really pleased with the new arrangement. 
So, it really was not a hard sell to eliminate shelving because we needed to weed those collections anyway. 
>> That's great, I am so glad that we could provide a catalyst for doing some reading. 
>> Exactly. 
>> So, once you have done that and cleared the space, how did you go about designing and who did you enlist to help with that? 
>> Well, you know, we initially reached out to our local office equipment vendor. 
He's worked with us on several space redesign projects over the years. 
And he's a very enthusiastic library user. 
So, he was, you know, he was into the project when we discussed it with him. 
He volunteered his advice during the early design phase. 
You know, while his, his input was valuable, his ideas were pretty mainstream. 
The skillshare space was too enclosed, it had panels and furniture that, that really came off more office-like than anything else. 
So, we felt a bit stuck, and we were not really able to fully conceptualize the space. 
We knew that we wanted something that, that popped, and that, you know, was, was unique in the library. 
But, being invested in the project, our rep talked with an architect when he was networking at a business meeting, and then that person became interested in the project and wanted to meet with us, discuss our goals for skillshare. 
So, when we talked together, you know, she was super enthusiastic, and actually, had, had her own programming ideas for the space. 
They did offer to do free design work for us, so, the creative solutions, solutions that they proposed, really, helped to propel the space transformation. 
Once we got information from them and, and their drafts, and the scale, the design elements, and the colors, then we were able to take this to staff and get their ideas and feedback, and that really helped us to fine tune the plan. 
>> Great, and we have a quick question from the audience. 
Can -- do you know the rough square footage so that they can get an idea of the scope or the scale of what we're talking about here? 
>> Yeah. 
It's about, about 10 by 30. 
>> Great, thank you. 
Then can you just briefly describe technology? 
I know that technology is a very important part of the modern library and how that is, incorporated in your space. 
Or will be. 
>> Yes. 
You can't see it here, but we have a 65-inch led smart TV connected to a mini computer above that panel. 
the advantage to this kind of setup -- oh, we also have screen software so we can upload the digital signage that displays upcoming events in the space on that screen. 
Another advantage to this setup for us is that the TV can also serve as a presentation screen, and so, presenters can connect laptops, via an input cable to the TV. 
>> Great, thanks. 
>> And I know that, that, you know, things happen and, and you know, we, we -- the friends of the library generously purchased that TV for us, and but, we are, you know, our library is a city department and, and so, we had a request in for, for installation and mounting and electricity into the space. 
And, and that was something is that, that took probably a couple of months to have happen. 
So, you know, some things are out of your hands, and question really learned to be patient during the course of this project. 
>> I think that relates to the next question of what the most challenging aspect of the project has been and, and, and maybe what advice you would have for others considering a similar project. 
>> Well, initially, for me, as the project manager, getting through the design phase was, was a challenge. 
We could visualize what an active programming space would look like, but, you know, figuring out what those components would be, was a struggle until we got the help that we got. 
We also had staffing changes and challenges during the course of the project. 
Our skillshare programming lead accepted a new position midway through the project. 
We were short staffed while we filled that and other positions. 
So, we were committed to developing new partnerships to make the skillshare a vibrant and active space. 
But, that requires time and effort from staff who have other responsibilities, so again, you know, we -- things just didn't go as, as quickly as we had hoped. 
but, I'm really -- I have to say, that I'm really proud of the support and the interest that the staff have shown in this project and in the slide, where you see the, the Quigong class, that was you're first community presentation, and those people participating are library users who just jumped in, but what you don't see in the perimeter are lots of staff who really wanted to be present and 
see what that space looked like when it was, you know, in use. 
So, there was a lot of interest and, and, and support to make this really work. 
>> That's so wonderful to hear that we have that support, and I want to point out really quickly that, that screen that, that you talked about is, is now visible in the space there, above those, those -- the, the lovely people, Quigong. 
I'm going to let you answer the more technical question, there is a question about software, and but, Jenny has a very interesting question about what reactions you have had from others using the library while program use is happening in the skillshare. 
Are there any issues? 
>> Well, you know, that, that -- we have not had any, anybody voice a concern. 
We did have a survey in the space, prior to having programming to, to see what people thought about, about, you know, the coming skillshare, and many people did voice concerns about, about noise level and, and but, we have not had any, anyone really, really complain about the level of noise. 
We have had staff ask, you know, what kind of limits do we put in place, you know, and where do we draw the line, and what might be too disruptive to the library use? 
And, and, and, you know, we're not sure yet, but, what I love is that, that this, actually, led to a discussion about having a skillshare annex outdoors, for some of our more adventurous programming, you know, why not take it outside? 
Have a pop-up skillshare for things like, you know, a home demonstration or woodwork with electrical tools. 
I love the way that we're thinking now. 
It's kind of has changed. 
>>> You know, the feeling of what we can do. 
>> That is so wonderful. 
I love the idea, the inside, outside, indoor, outdoor connection and the pop-up, and what I have noticed from both your library and Eileen's library experience, just when, when you -- the act of opening up the space, so clearing it out, and opening it up, and created this anticipation that then started to, to invite the, this more open thinking about possibilities, so, that is really for me, 
this affirmation that by clearing the physical space, literally clearing it, you are opening up the ability to, to rethink and reframe how it could be used. 
Well, thank you very much, Beth, and that's very exciting. 
I want to move on to the nooksack valley heritage center, which is the way that the everson branch decided to make use of this opportunity to create a new space in their library. 
 at this point I will welcome Eileen Shaw to go through very similar, if not the same questions, to get your, an idea of your experience of, of doing this transformation space opportunity. 
So, let's start with how you arrived at your decision of how you wanted to transform the space and, and how you decided where to locate it. 
>> All right, well, we began similar to Bellingham, we discussed ideas with our staff and our friends group, and we came up with four suggestions, and then we, we sent those out to the community at large, and asked the public to choose amongst those, but, as we assessed the results we got back, we did not really see a clear favorite, and we also realized that, that the recommendations really could 
be met in the normal course of library improvements. 
We went back to the drawing board and turned our attention to, to our longstanding focus on, on local history, and we decided to build upon that successful groundwork and create the Nooksack valley heritage center within the library. 
And as far as deciding where to locate it, we are small, we only have a little over 4,000 square feet, so the options are not great. 
But, we first thought about converting the reading area, it was already furnished with tables and chairs. 
But, that area had its own dedicated group of users and, and we did not necessarily want to display, displays them and disgrudges them, and so we thought more and settled on a space in the center. 
It is right in the sightline of the circ desk, and it was an awkward area anyway. 
Once again, similar to Bellingham. 
It housed a collection that was dwindling, and our reference collection, and VHS, books on tape, and some other things, so, this area really needed to be repurposed anyway. 
>> Wonderful. 
And it's very exciting to hear and understand that, that you had to do some sort of interpretation of the initial results of your survey to really focus in on something that was important to the library, and let the whole thing percolate to arrive at, at the space that, that, actually, you ended up being workable. 
To be clear, this is, everson library is the smaller of the two libraries, so it serves a community of only 3,000 people. 
So, now, to the question about, about what you needed to, to let go of in order to clear out that space, and because as you said, you are a small library, and you probably feel like every, every square foot is valuable. 
>> That's right. 
>> Well, once again, similar to Bellingham, we had to reduce other collections to, to move certain things out of the center area. 
And so, we reduced and reconfigured our adult fiction, and that, actually, improved traffic patterns, and it made way for the two internet stations from the center. 
And our adult non fiction was subjected to that same fate and, and so, that, that is the displayed audio books and music c.d.s could be accommodated, but happily, these collection reductions -- 
>> Oh, dear. 
I think we lost Eileen. 
It looks like her phone connection just -- she's probably working on getting back on there. 
>> Ok. 
While Eileen is getting back on, Beth, if you are willing, if you could come back on and talk a bit about the programming form that you developed as a result of the skillshare, that you realized you needed some guidelines and some policy around who are what could actually participate in this space. 
Could you just talk briefly about that? 
>> Yes. 
We developed the skillshare proposal form that, that is a bit different than our regular library programming application. 
And basically, we're letting people know that for this particular space, we will not -- we will not do press releases and some of the traditional marketing. 
We want this space to be very nimble. 
So, what we'll do is, is advertise it on the digital signage, and -- it will come back to me, there is one other way. 
But those folks are also responsible for the setup and the takedown, which is really simple because of the furniture pieces that we got. 
They are very light and very easy to move to the side. 
We want, you know, we're still -- we don't have a ton of programming happening yet. 
And so, I'm sure that there will be more things that we'll be working out. 
But we really wanted people to be able to come in and not have some of the restrictions or hurdles like, like our meeting rooms have. 
It does not need to be a lot of lead time. 
We had somebody come in from, from local music, a local music store who wants to offer a, offer ukulele lessons in the space, so he'll be in this afternoon, and he's going to bring a dozen ukuleles, and teach some basic course, and we want to, to allow things like that. 
We don't want to be too restrictive from the get-go, so, you know, clearly, if somebody comes in and wants to, to, you know, to butcher animal, we don't -- there is some things that we cannot do. 
[Laughter] 
>> We don't have, you know, we don't have water. 
We don't have a sink. 
We don't, you know, so you know, we're going to -- we're really going to take it case by case, and we're also hoping that once we have a more active calendar program, that, that word of mouth continues to spread. 
One thing that we have found is a good use of the space is for, for people who, are using our meeting rooms for, for kind of full-blown programs. 
They can use the skillshare space to give a teaser ahead of time. 
A week ahead of time, and you know, give a demonstration or be available to, to kind of promote that activity, so it's a nice tie-in. 
>> That's great. 
Yeah. 
It's really -- it's so interesting that once you are inviting the possibilities, you also have -- you can think a little more, a little more deliberately about what is going to work and what is not going to work. 
Let's see -- it looks like we have got Eileen back, and if we can get Eileen unmuted. 
I like that idea. 
Holiday programming. 
Eileen, are you back? 
>> I am. 
Sorry about that. 
>> Oh, no problem. 
We managed to fill the time, and I am going to move to the next question, but I wanted to just bring up this quote from you, which I loved, about your shows heeding a collective sigh of relief after being liberated from too much weight. 
How is that for inspiration for weeding your collection? 
>> So, if you can tell us a bit about how you went about designing the space, and whose support you got? 
>> Oh, great. 
I, actually, love this question so I am glad I'm back. 
There may be disadvantages to living in a small community, but one of the big advantages is that we're close-knit, and we care about each other, and it's easy to get that, that enthusiasm spread amongst the whole community, and that's what happened. 
Our local businesses not only sold and donated materials to us, but they also demonstrated their interest and helped with ideas, and as a sidelight, the electrician doing the work, got a library card while working for us. 
Besides the businesses, our library friends were intimately involved, and completely supportive. 
One board member, you see his picture there on the left with the hat, had experience already with the company that specializes in interactive museum exhibits and interpretive environments. 
He really became the visionary for the project. 
As he started directing ideas, a remarkable group of volunteers, you can see for the guys sitting there, became, became involved and shared their, their, their experiences with us. 
So, interestingly enough, we were talking about a glass dividing wall that we decided to build, and the patron overheard that conversation, and he offered his help, and he was a draftsmen in his younger days, can and he still had all the tools, and he volunteered to drop the plans by hand, the old fashioned way, and then he stayed to help build a wall, and a couple other guys similar situation, a 
local contractor, just volunteered their time. 
I ended up calling these guys the glass wall conspirators, they came together and developed a camaraderie, and they invested late nights and, and spent a lot of time figuring out the details, and then work-arounds as needed, so basically, what happened, was a small rural community engagement at its most engaging. 
>> Wonderful. 
That's so, so warming to hear. 
So, what did you find to be the most challenging aspect of this project? 
>> Well, once again, similar to Bellingham's experience was, was probably the time element. 
It took longer than anticipated. 
We had several setbacks, and turnarounds, and our ideas kept evolving, and we could not be rushed because final decisions were dependent on previous steps. 
And also we were working with volunteers who had busy lives. 
>> Is there any advice in particular that you would give to others? 
I think I heard from both of you that these things really need time, so, it's hard to rush some decisions, and if you have some time to, to expand your thinking or do some rethinking, you probably end up with a stronger result in the long run? 
>> That's exactly right. 
It was truly a rewarding process, but it did take time, I think that would be my number one piece of advice is, is to plan from the very beginning that you need to set aside time that's dedicated to this process. 
It's sort of like the materials, you had to, to get rid of some things to make space, and you need to, to, to find a place for that time to, to devote. 
Also, I just -- finding that there were community members with unique skills that, that were really willing to be involved in a short-term project like this, reminded me that, that people are the most important component. 
Our library's mission statement is, connecting information, ideas, and community, and the key element is community. 
>> That is, that is such a beautiful statement. 
The key element is community. 
Yes. 
And, and that is just so, so -- so essential to this idea of opening up space in the library so your community has room to be there and to engage. 
Well, thank you very much and, and I will, I will let you respond to questions in chat if there are questions coming up so that we can move forward, but, I also want to encourage anyone in the audience to share your own experiences or spaces that you know about that are similar projects of creating space in the middle of the library and, and bringing this community in. 
Let's look at a few things that, that a few ideas, maybe, a few things that you need to let go of or hurdles that need to be surmounted in order to really create those stunts that, that invite the community in. 
So, one is this whole idea of flexibility of space. 
And, and a lot of that has to do with removing barriers, removing immovable objects, and how many of you have, have fort circulation, this enormous circulation desk, or fort reference? 
Think about, if you take everything mentally out of your space and think about how it could be used, do you really need that? 
Do you really need large tables that are not easy to move? 
A real key to, to flexibility is thinking of all your spaces as multi-use space, or several spaces as multi-use space. 
We had a previous Webinar along the same topic, the flexible future spaces Webinar, and which was a lot about the King county library system in Washington State. 
There are major renovations and building of new libraries. 
One of my favorite examples from that is, is the Covington library that was in a community where the library was the primary community space for people in meetings, to meet, and the community said oh, we have to have a 400-seat meeting room. 
But, that did not fit in with the budget, it did not fit in with the lot size, or the possibilities, so, the rethinking came in to, to, to, we'll just make the library the meeting room by making it very flexible. 
Flexibility, the KASTER is your friend. 
You put everything on wheels. 
The tables, the chairs, the units are small, and you put your shelves on wheels and, and, and keep them low, and so that anything can be moved in or out of the space to adjust to, to the needs of the space. 
It worked out beautifully, it is still working out beautifully at the Covington library, and you can watch the Webinar for more details on that whole idea. 
I came across this, what I think is the ultimate flexible maker space. 
It's in the red fire wagon with a few other things. 
So, think flexible and multi-use, and think wheels and casters. 
And this is something that came up when Beth was talking, all of the noise and the chaos. 
A very natural reaction to thinking about inviting the, the community into your space, and I just -- I want to relate this story that, that was an early success and surprise for the Bellingham public library. 
And before they had their skill share space in place and, and they have an annual holiday tech fair where they invite vendors to bring in mobile devices, that, that the, the patrons can come in and experiment with and find out more about, and so, they have, they have had this year after year but always held it in a separate meeting room in the basement, so, very, very separate from the library. 
The meeting room was not available this year, and I think that, that it was Beth, and I will give you the credit, Beth are of saying why don't we have it in the library? 
There was a lot of anticipation of oh, no, it will be too noisy and chaotic. 
Well, happy results, it was the best attended holiday tech fair that they have ever had, one of the best the representatives said, like black Friday at the library. 
And, and as far as I know, nobody complained about the noise or the chaos. 
So, I think that, that it's worth experimenting and trying before we just throw up our hands and say, we cannot do this, there is too much noise. 
Think of the Westport public library with the make or space in the middle of the library. 
Then there is the, how do you open up space? 
And we heard from both Beth and Eileen about their weeding efforts and, and it was interesting, they have similarities in what they weeded, so it really involves taking a fresh look at the collection and understanding what may be is not as viable as it was five years ago. 
the King county library system has this formula five items per square foot. 
It sounds brutal. 
But, they have been really inspired by, by the idea of choice overload, there is talk by Sheena about her studies of choice overload, and the finding is we tend to think, especially in our culture, that the more choices, the better, and the happier we will be. 
But, what studies have found is that choice is overwhelming, and people presented with too many choices are more likely to not make any choice. 
So, if you really think about tearing down your collection, so that you can really focus on, on items, you can showcase them in a way that they are discoverable and visibly displayed, keep them at eye level, and keep the, the, what we call the patron pass, the way that people move through the library more clear, and that you are, actually, going to augment the opportunity for people to, to connect 
with your collection. 
And just as, as -- for me, this is just such a strong, visual example of, of the everson library, the before and the after picture, remember this was the before with the c.d.s and the audio books that, that have space on the right, and look at the transformation. 
Now, community members are in the space, and they are, they are using it, and they are learning, and they are, they are contributing, and, and the ideas that they are creating their own digital histories and adding to the collection of, of -- I like to do that again because, because I just think that transformation visually says it all. 
Let go of that collection. 
You can do it. 
Then, the reality in the modern library is, is technology is all about connections to data, and electrical outlets. 
So, it's really important to think, as part of the transformation, think about how this is done, and where you can, you can augment this. 
This image here is, is from the King county library system, and this is the public library and this is an architect's vision of what will be built. 
It hasn't happened yet. 
But it is a library built over a river, as it looks. 
It was blt with a lot of cement, and not a lot of opportunity to bring in power connections to implore. 
So what the architect's solution was for this situation is to drop the connections from the ceiling throughout, and do it in a way that fits with the architecture and the decor so it looks like an architectural element and not a mess of power lines. 
But it is important to be mindful of technology because your patients will cluster around technical outlets. 
and then this wonderful power that we heard from both Beth and Eileen of tapping your community as a resource. 
It's very easy to, to, to limit your own thinking by, by feeling like well, we don't have that expertise. 
We don't have people who can do x, y, or z, and we don't have an architect or a designer or somebody who can envision how to engage what electronics will, will engage with the space. 
And I just -- I think that the two libraries, the two pilot libraries in this project are, are perfect illustrations of, of the power that resides in your community. 
If you just get out there and ask, your community has things to offer. 
And by getting people in your community engaged in the transformation, they become invested, and they become much more likely to carry it forward and keep that enthusiasm and momentum going forward and engage even deeper into the community. 
So, do not overlook your community as a resource. 
They have the expertise. 
This illustration is, is -- it's an architectural vision that, that the architect that Beth connected with provided for their library and for that space because as I remember Beth saying, she felt paralyzed by that phase of the project, like oh, I don't know how to do this. 
Well, someone in your community does know how to do it. 
and then there is the cost. 
I think that it's very, very common and very understandable when considering a new project to first think of cost and think like well, we only have this much money so we cannot do x, y, z, or to, to, to think of, if we only had 10,000, just think of what we could do. 
It's hard to, to -- I don't have any clear answers to that. 
So, I would really just like to relate a story that I found very inspiring. 
And I heard the story in another Webjunction Webinar, and I was -- it was the future is now, rural libraries as innovation incubators, and I think that, that it's misleading to think that Webinar was only about rural libraries because it's really about ways to open up your own thinking. 
To get beyond thinking outside of the box to thinking that there is no box. 
Really, an excellent Webinar. 
But, the story was told by, by the youth services librarian at the small and rural Laural public library in Delaware. 
Her story is, she read an article one day about, about a maker space built in some library somewhere, with a $10,000 fund to do it, and her first gut reaction was, oh, wow, that's not going to happen here. 
Meaning, we don't have that kind of money, so we're not going to get a media lab. 
But, she did a little mental rewind, and sort of slowed down and, and rethought and reframed the situation, and thought about, about well, what could we do? 
What do we have already that we can work with? 
And what, what can we add that would not cost a lot? 
So she ended up spending $400 to get, to build on what they already had and get some additional hardware and software tools that was enough to invite some teens into the space to start interacting and creating. 
Teens loved it, the community loved it. 
And it got attention. 
With that kind of attention, and that, that evidence of success, tamika and her director found somebody in the community who could fund a complete media lab, so, and in her own words, she said, it went from being this big, huge, scary thing that could never happen to look at these young people right now, and using the digital media lab. 
So, I think that the moral is, don't wait, don't feel like if I only had 10,000, I could do x, y, and z, or if I only had the opportunity to build a whole new library, I could do x, y, and z. 
Look at what you have and think creatively about how you can really maximize it. 
So, we're going to use the check mark, one last time. 
So get ready with that mark because I know that we all have something that we need to let go of in order to do that mental reframing and rethinking and reenvisioning. 
So, you can check as many boxes as apply, and what, what, on this list, do you feel like you really need to let go of in your library? 
And then as you are marking, since I have no way of knowing who you are and what you are marking, make a note to yourself, if this is something that I really need to let go of or these things that I need to let go of, what am I going to do? 
What are my next steps is this if it's I need to let go of fort circulation, maybe it's get a floor plan of the library without any stuff in it and just open up the flow of ideas about what could go into that space? 
If it's the collection, look at some of those studies, watch, watch the talk about, about the choice overload problem. 
Just take some next steps to letting go so you can really open the space and you can invite the community in. 
So, we have a bit of time left. 
Do we have questions that have come through? 
Well, there were some questions in there that, that Beth responded to. 
Thank you, Beth. 
And then there were all these great ideas being shared around the kinds of programming folks are doing in their libraries, so we have actually had a whole back and forth about how we, at Webjunction, can help showcase your great work. 
So, I have already noted who I am going to follow up with here. 
But, if folks have questions specific to our panelists today, we do have time to discuss here, so there is a great question about, about maybe we can ask both Beth and Eileen around the options for circulation area, if you remove the large circulation desk. 
I know Beth, you talked about that your area involved the pickup, and maybe you can talk about how that skillshare activity area intersects with the circulation process. 
>> Well, can you hear me? 
>> Yes, we can. 
>> Ok. 
So, you know, it really hasn't, at this point, really impacted circulation, what we did notice is, is that we had a kiosk at one end of the skillshare that, that has books on display, and, and that kiosk did not have casters, and it was not easily moved. 
So, we did get casters on that, a lot of people came in and tended to stop and observe, and then cluster around and just block that walkway alongside self checkout. 
So, that's something that, that we're, we're just going to keep an eye on. 
And, and today, I think that we'll, actually, experience that, when we have the ukulele class, that will move that piece of, of furniture out of the way, so we can see what the flow, actually, is. 
but, it really, you know, we have staff who are, who are, you know, putting a hold on the shelf and staff who are still shelving new books, and when things are happening, and I think that we allowed for, you know, for the right amount of space in that perimeter so that, that the circ staff can get their work done with something is going on. 
>> And I don't know, Eileen, did you have any, any thoughts about circulation? 
I'm not sure that there were any changes at your library. 
>> No. 
Not in our circulation area, but I did want to respond, I think, it was E.T., in the chat asking about if the heritage center could be reserved for a skill-share type activity. 
And my answer is yes, we have already had classes in that area and, and teaching, so definitely, that arena could be used for, for different programming. 
>> Great. 
And I'll just throw in real quickly, somebody asked about defining five items per square feet. 
That's if you take the square footage of the library, and the, the number of items in your collection, physical items in the collection and, and you want five items per square foot. 
So, they are not spread out over the square footage, but obviously, concentrated in certain, certain locations, and the King county library system has done a really wonderful job of, of Augustmenting and collating the physical items with, with access to electronic items. 
So, I really recommend watching that Webinar to get, to get a better idea, or reading, we put in a link to the report from King county? 
>> No, we can add that in. 
>> We'll add that to the resource page. 
There is a report on rethinking collection space that King county put together that's really, really informative. 
So, there's a question about, about space policy and, and, and in terms of, you know, who can use it, does it cost anything, are there any sort of scheduling requirements? 
I know Beth talked about how much time in advance that they work with, with programming, folks that are doing programming. 
But, it would be great to hear how you all have, if you have policies around use and, and can you talk a bit about that? 
Let's go ahead and start with Eileen. 
>> It hasn't been a real issue for us yet. 
But, as we move into the future, that will be something we need to define clearly. 
Certainly, no cost. 
It's not a very large area that we have, so, so that's going to limit the people who might be interested to begin with. 
So, I think that that's something that we're going to have to grab hold of as we go along, actually. 
>> Great. 
Thank you. 
And Beth? 
>> Yeah, actually, we have in the proposal form that the skill share host will offer his or her skills at no charge to the library or the public, and that they agree to follow our rules of conduct, our community room policy, and our local state and Federal laws. 
So, there really is, I think, a lot of, you know, a lot of room there to, to, to, to do new things and get within those guidelines. 
>> Excellent. 
There is a question about how many people can participate or fit into the skillshare space, and I would love to hear how many people fit into each of your spaces. 
Beth, how many people can safely fit into your skillshare space? 
>> We have seating for 16 in the space. 
We have four small tables. 
When the space is open, it's going to depend on the event. 
When we have the Quigong demonstration, you know, really having, maybe, six to eight people actively doing the movement. 
That kind of maxed out the space, and that is an example of a full-blown program that would be in our, in our regular meeting room later with more participants. 
>> Excellent, and how about Eileen, how many people can fit into your space? 
>> I'm going to say a maximum of 12. 
I am counting the seating in there, and for our ancestry class, we had eight comfortably. 
And I would just like to say that we also have a very flexible space in another part of our library that is normally has got rolling, shelving units, and that's where we have the larger programming, it's very flexible, next to this, this new, new center that we made. 
>> That's fantastic. 
So, that really demonstrates that you don't need to think about being limited to one, one community space. 
It could be that, that the needs vary enough for, for what sort of intimacy the group needs, so that's another great reminder that even if you have, perhaps, a meeting room space that you are using, that it may be there is another way to really build that community engagement within the library space, as well. 
>> Yes, it's the flexibility, flexibility with a capital f. 
>> Excellent. 
Well, we are at the top of the hour, and I just want to thank all three of you, Betha, Eileen, and Beth for bringing all of this great work to the forefront and to our conversation today. 
I want to thank all of you for, for jumping right in and participating in the conversation, and I will be following up with a couple of you story-tellers who had just teased us with a bit about your story, but I just have a reminder, these are exactly the kinds of stories we love to showcase, and we are, our homepage features stories frequently, that tell those stories you share with us, so, 
please know that you can share your story at any time, but, we can work with you in whatever way to bring those stories to the forefront. 
So, just a reminder, before we wrap up, that, that the archive will be posted later today, and we'll send you an email, and we do encourage you to subscribe to crossroads, our monthly E-newsletter that will keep you up to date on all of the great stories coming in to Webjunction, as well as our ongoing programming. 
I will ask that, as you leave, we'll be sending you to a survey that provides you with an opportunity to give us some feedback that we will share with our presenters, and that can help to inform our ongoing programming. 
So, thank you again, and everyone have a fantastic day. 
>> Thank you, Eileen, and Beth.